hydrogen in tires

[krminyl@...]

I think the main advantage of nitrogen vs. compressed air is that the
nitrogen is dry, and has no moisture in it, which is bad for tires. Costco,
who is
now becoming one of the nation's largest passenger car and light truck tire
retailers, now use nitrogen when installing their new tires. that's what
they told me anyway...FWIW....

Kevin
Yorba Linda, CA
1986 38' PT


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[adieu2ysailing]

Nitrogen
I keep reading about putting nitrogen in tires. 2 web sites: www.
ezinearticles.com/?Selling-Nitrogen-In-Tires---Is-It-All-A-Lot-Of-Hot-Air?&id=38\
142
and http://www.getnitrogen.org
They say 78% of our air is nitrogen so are we just trying to
eliminate the 21% of the oxygen? Is it worth the trouble? I will say
trying to maintain the correct tire pressure is a PITA. The FMCA mag.
had an article several issues back about carrying a pressurized tank
of Nitrogen to top off when needed.
I'd appreciate thoughts and/or comments.

Jack VanDenBerg
Glenn, Mi. Presently in SPI, Tx
`05 Lxi450

[Gardner Yeaw]

There are at least two advantages to nitrogen.

The first is that it should have little or no moisture because it is
produced at a specialized facility where there should be certain
levels of quality control. Compressed air from in-house compressors
contains water, the amount depends on the current humidity.

Second, nitrogen is an inert gas, that is to say it does not
react chemicaly with anything. Oxygen, as you know, reacts with most
everything. So filling with nitrogen will prevent oxidation of the
inner tire as well as the rim.

Is it worth the extra cost, if any? I don't know. But if you
decide to go that way you need to continue to use it wen you adjust
tire pressure or you will end up contaminating the atmosphere inside
the tire. So carry a tank of nitrogen or seek out local suppliers.

Gardner
78FC33


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, krminyl@... wrote:
>
> I think the main advantage of nitrogen vs. compressed air is that
the
> nitrogen is dry, and has no moisture in it, which is bad for
tires. Costco, who is
> now becoming one of the nation's largest passenger car and light
truck tire
> retailers, now use nitrogen when installing their new tires.
that's what
> they told me anyway...FWIW....
>
> Kevin
> Yorba Linda, CA
> 1986 38' PT
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Doug Engel]

As an owner/operator of a tire store, I have been hit up by all my suppliers to
get on board with the nitrogen trend. While there are benefits of nitrogen that
cannot be disputed, the nitrogen systems are being promoted to me as primarily a
new profit center. The dryness of nitrogen as I see it is most beneficial in new
vehicles that have TMPS on board, due to the sensitivity of the TPMS sensors to
moisture (not to mention their rather costly replacement value).
It it worth it to replace the "air" in your rigs tires with nitrogen? I
suppose every little bit helps (dryness, pressure stability, tread life), but in
the grand scheme of things, I just can't see it. Another thing to keep in mind,
there is no substitute for putting a gauge on your tires every day (or at least
"bumping" them. Don't let nitrogen's claims to greater pressure stability lull
you into thinking your tires are fine. I see more tire failures due to lack of
correct pressure (usually from natural aspiration or slow leaks) than any other
culprit. Doug n' Pokey

Gardner Yeaw wrote:
There are at least two advantages to nitrogen.

The first is that it should have little or no moisture because it is
produced at a specialized facility where there should be certain
levels of quality control. Compressed air from in-house compressors
contains water, the amount depends on the current humidity.

Second, nitrogen is an inert gas, that is to say it does not
react chemicaly with anything. Oxygen, as you know, reacts with most
everything. So filling with nitrogen will prevent oxidation of the
inner tire as well as the rim.

Is it worth the extra cost, if any? I don't know. But if you
decide to go that way you need to continue to use it wen you adjust
tire pressure or you will end up contaminating the atmosphere inside
the tire. So carry a tank of nitrogen or seek out local suppliers.

Gardner
78FC33


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, krminyl@... wrote:
>
> I think the main advantage of nitrogen vs. compressed air is that
the
> nitrogen is dry, and has no moisture in it, which is bad for
tires. Costco, who is
> now becoming one of the nation's largest passenger car and light
truck tire
> retailers, now use nitrogen when installing their new tires.
that's what
> they told me anyway...FWIW....
>
> Kevin
> Yorba Linda, CA
> 1986 38' PT
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>






Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO. 1981 FC35SB "Pokey"
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Curt Sprenger]

I use CO2, a 20 pound bottle, has worked for me for 30+ years. Email me
privately and I'll forward to you a picture of the tank, gauge, hose
that I carry in our 'Bird.

Curt Sprenger
1987 PT38 8V92 "MacAttack Racing"
Anaheim Hills, Calif.



adieu2ysailing wrote:

>Nitrogen
>I keep reading about putting nitrogen in tires. 2 web sites: www.
>ezinearticles.com/?Selling-Nitrogen-In-Tires---Is-It-All-A-Lot-Of-Hot-Air?&id=3\
8142
> and http://www.getnitrogen.org
> They say 78% of our air is nitrogen so are we just trying to
>eliminate the 21% of the oxygen? Is it worth the trouble? I will say
>trying to maintain the correct tire pressure is a PITA. The FMCA mag.
>had an article several issues back about carrying a pressurized tank
>of Nitrogen to top off when needed.
>I'd appreciate thoughts and/or comments.
>
>Jack VanDenBerg
>Glenn, Mi. Presently in SPI, Tx
>`05 Lxi450
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

[Don Bradner]

Nitrogen is not an inert gas. I haven't done the research to learn its relative
corrosiveness compared with oxygen, but it is corrosive.

On 1/10/2007 at 12:57 AM Gardner Yeaw wrote:

>There are at least two advantages to nitrogen.

> Second, nitrogen is an inert gas, that is to say it does not
>react chemicaly with anything. Oxygen, as you know, reacts with most
>everything. So filling with nitrogen will prevent oxidation of the
>inner tire as well as the rim.

Don Bradner
90 PT40 without-a-name so far

[Jack & Donna Smith]

Yes, I have heard some good things about using Nitrogen in the tires..
The tank can also power Air Tools.
But I use CO2 in mine, a 20#tank for the Bird and a 5# one for the
Jeep. Interestingly enough, it costs the same to refill either one...

But the heading, "Hydrogen in Tires" sounds interging.. And, at the
first good pothole, it may give a new meaning to
"Leaps Tall Buildings with a Single Bound"!
Jack Smith
1873FC31
SoCal


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "adieu2ysailing"
wrote:
>
> Nitrogen
> I keep reading about putting nitrogen in tires. 2 web sites: www.
>
ezinearticles.com/?Selling-Nitrogen-In-Tires---Is-It-All-A-Lot-Of-Hot-Air?&id=38\
142
> and http://www.getnitrogen.org
> They say 78% of our air is nitrogen so are we just trying to
> eliminate the 21% of the oxygen? Is it worth the trouble? I will say
> trying to maintain the correct tire pressure is a PITA. The FMCA mag.
> had an article several issues back about carrying a pressurized tank
> of Nitrogen to top off when needed.
> I'd appreciate thoughts and/or comments.
>
> Jack VanDenBerg
> Glenn, Mi. Presently in SPI, Tx
> `05 Lxi450
>

[Juergen]

Yes, the title is very interesting. Hydrogen, well the HINDENBURG was not too
sucessful on landing in NJ, so if you run on Hydrogen, stay out of the heat or
warm climates
Juergen in PA
1991 WLSP36

Jack & Donna Smith wrote: Yes,
I have heard some good things about using Nitrogen in the tires..
The tank can also power Air Tools.
But I use CO2 in mine, a 20#tank for the Bird and a 5# one for the
Jeep. Interestingly enough, it costs the same to refill either one...

But the heading, "Hydrogen in Tires" sounds interging.. And, at the
first good pothole, it may give a new meaning to
"Leaps Tall Buildings with a Single Bound"!
Jack Smith
1873FC31
SoCal

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "adieu2ysailing"
wrote:
>
> Nitrogen
> I keep reading about putting nitrogen in tires. 2 web sites: www.
>

ezinearticles.com/?Selling-Nitrogen-In-Tires---Is-It-All-A-Lot-Of-Hot-Air?&id=38\
142
> and http://www.getnitrogen.org
> They say 78% of our air is nitrogen so are we just trying to
> eliminate the 21% of the oxygen? Is it worth the trouble? I will say
> trying to maintain the correct tire pressure is a PITA. The FMCA mag.
> had an article several issues back about carrying a pressurized tank
> of Nitrogen to top off when needed.
> I'd appreciate thoughts and/or comments.
>
> Jack VanDenBerg
> Glenn, Mi. Presently in SPI, Tx
> `05 Lxi450
>





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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Pete Masterson]

From Wikipedia:

Nitrogen is a nonmetal, with an electronegativity of 3.0. It has five
electrons in its outer shell and is therefore trivalent in most
compounds. The triple bond in molecular nitrogen (N2) is the
strongest in nature. The resulting difficulty of converting (N2) into
other compounds, and the ease (and associated high energy release) of
converting nitrogen compounds into elemental N2, have dominated the
role of nitrogen in both nature and human economic activities. [In
other words, many nitrogen compounds are quite explosive, but
elemental nitrogen is quite stable.]

Nitrogen gas has a wide variety of applications, including serving as
an inert replacement for air where oxidation is undesirable;
To preserve the freshness of packaged or bulk foods (by delaying
rancidity and other forms of oxidative damage)
On top of liquid explosives for safety
The production of electronic parts such as transistors, diodes, and
integrated circuits
Dried and pressurized, as a dielectric gas for high voltage equipment
The manufacture of stainless steel
Use in military aircraft fuel systems to reduce fire hazard, see
inerting system
Filling automotive and aircraft tires[1] due to its inertness and
lack of moisture or oxidative qualities, as opposed to air, though
this is not necessary for consumer automobiles.[2]
Nitrogen molecules are less likely to escape from the inside of a
tire compared to the traditional air mixture used. Air consists
mostly of nitrogen and oxygen. Nitrogen molecules have a larger
effective diameter than oxygen molecules and therefore diffuse
through porous substances more slowly.[3]
A further example of its versatility is its use as a preferred
alternative to carbon dioxide to pressurize kegs of some beers,
particularly thicker stouts and Scottish and English ales, due to the
smaller bubbles it produces, which make the dispensed beer smoother
and headier. A modern application of a pressure sensitive nitrogen
capsule known commonly as a "widget" now allows nitrogen charged
beers to be packaged in cans and bottles.
====
You can read the complete article at <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
Nitrogen_gas>
Elemental Nitrogen is "almost" inert as it does not give up it's N2
molecular form easily. Under pressures in an engine, nitrogen-oxides
can form and other chemical processes can "fix" nitrogen in a
biologically useful form. In tires, it would essentially be
considered inert.

Since hydrogen is quite a small molecule, it would escape from tires
much more readily than nitrogen. Probably wouldn't make a great
filler for tires. Hydrogen is also quite explosive under certain
circumstances.

When I purchased a compressor (to keep up my tire pressures), I also
purchased a filter attachment. It seems to remove a fair amount of
the water from the compressed air before it goes into the tire.

Pete Masterson
aeonix1@...
'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42'
El Sobrante, CA




On Jan 9, 2007, at 6:23 PM, Don Bradner wrote:

> Nitrogen is not an inert gas. I haven't done the research to learn
> its relative corrosiveness compared with oxygen, but it is corrosive.
>
> On 1/10/2007 at 12:57 AM Gardner Yeaw wrote:
>
>> There are at least two advantages to nitrogen.
>
>> Second, nitrogen is an inert gas, that is to say it does not
>> react chemicaly with anything. Oxygen, as you know, reacts with most
>> everything. So filling with nitrogen will prevent oxidation of the
>> inner tire as well as the rim.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Gardner Yeaw]

Don,
You got me! but nitrogen is not as corrosive as oxygen.
Here is a description:

Nitrogen gas is slightly lighter than air and slightly soluble in
water. It is commonly thought of and used as an inert gas; but it
is not truly inert. It forms nitric oxide and nitrogen dioxide with
oxygen, ammonia with hydrogen, and nitrogen sulfide with sulfur.
Nitrogen compounds are formed naturally through biological
activity. Compounds are also formed at high temperature or at
moderate temperature with the aid of catalysts. At high
temperatures, nitrogen will combine with active metals, such as
lithium, magnesium and titanium to form nitrides. Nitrogen is
necessary for various biological processes, and is used as a
fertilizer, usually in the form of ammonia or ammonia-based
compounds. Compounds formed with halogens and certain organic
compounds can be explosive.

Gardner
78FC33
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
wrote:
>
> Nitrogen is not an inert gas. I haven't done the research to learn
its relative corrosiveness compared with oxygen, but it is corrosive.
>
> On 1/10/2007 at 12:57 AM Gardner Yeaw wrote:
>
> >There are at least two advantages to nitrogen.
>
> > Second, nitrogen is an inert gas, that is to say it does not
> >react chemicaly with anything. Oxygen, as you know, reacts with
most
> >everything. So filling with nitrogen will prevent oxidation of
the
> >inner tire as well as the rim.
>
> Don Bradner
> 90 PT40 without-a-name so far
>