Trojan Batteries And Chargers

[George Lowry]

Hi James,

First thing to remember is: Everything in an RV is a compromise. Cost
vs. convenience vs. life cycle vs. god only knows what. The most bang
for the buck or AH per $$ is the lead acid batteries. The AGM (Absorbed
Glass Mat) gives the next best and the Gel is the most expensive for the
AH Capacity. For the house batteries, AH capacity is the determining
factor.

In this Alpine, they put Interstate lead acid wet batteries. I have
never had good luck with Interstates but will try them until they fail.
Also, we have only had this rig for two weeks and do not have enough
experience with it to give a good analysis.

In the GM bus we converted, I had four Trojan L-16 Batteries in
series-parallel. That was the best I could fit in the space and for the
cost. There are better batteries such as the Surette and the Rolls but
the cost is prohibitive. When we bought the Wanderlodge, the dealer had
replaced the Gell cells with Interstate Lead acid wet cells. Three
boiled before we made it home and the other three followed soon after.
Interstate refused to stand behind them. I replaced them with the East
Penn Deka AGM (12V). The advantage was that no service was needed
however, the AH capacity was lower. Those batteries have served well.

Re: Charging: With a three stage charger, the charging rate varies.
For most, with the battery at 70 degrees F, the first stage is commonly
called the "bulk" stage. This means that the charger will pour in the
full rate until the voltage raises to 14.4 volts. In the "acceptance"
stage the voltage is maintained at 14.4V and the current rate (amps)
decreases until it reaches some predetermined percentage of the battery
capacity, usually around 2 - 4%. At that point, the voltage is reduced
to the "float" voltage, around 13.5 - 13.7 volts. It normally took me
about three hours to recharge the batteries after draining them to the
50% level.

Hope this helps. I have just been called for dinner. If you have more
questions, please ask.

George Lowry
'06 Alpine Apex - Former owner '95 WBDA 4203
Spearfish, SD in Palm Springs


orbitalsolutions wrote:

>Sounds good, Steve. I will talk to you further about the fill
>system if I decide to go with the T-145's.
>
>I'm confused about conventional lead-acid and the new AGM
>batteries. I am trying to understand the practical differences in
>charging time to bring a bank up from a 50% discharge.
>
>Lifeline Co. has a 6V AGM that is a perfect repacement. At 6 volts
>they are rated at 220AH. Four of these babies will give me a total
>of 440AH @ 12V. I like the idea of a sealed power cell, but I have
>lived with Trojans for many years. What I would like to know is if
>there is a shorter charge time needed for AGM than the Trojans,
>given a fixed charge rate of 110A 3 stage temperature sensitive
>charge.
>
>I think George Lowery might be able to help me(if that's possible).
>
>George, in your new Apex I believe you have Lifeline AGM's. If so,
>is the value of the battery bank 12V? What is the total AH rating
>of the bank? At a 50% discharge, how long do you have to run your
>genny to get a full charge? Lastly, How many amps are you charging
>them with?
>
>AGM's may be worth the price to me if they redeuce the charge time
>compared to the Trojans. I hve been informed, by theory experts,
>that the rate of charge of AGM types is unlimited, but I do not want
>to spent 1500 dollars for chargers. I am going to replace the
>originals with (2) 55A 3 stage temp sensing chargers.
>
>That gives me a charging total of 110Amps. Will these chargers take
>a 50% depleted AGM bank to full considerably faster than if they
>were charging the Trojans?
>
>Theory is just that. I am interested in practical application
>results, and have no refrence points.
>
>Still scratching my head and learning.
>
>
>-James
>78FC33SB
>LasVegas NV
>
>
>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Birtles"
> wrote:
>
>
>>you can use a single point battery watering system
>>I have them
>>Stephen 77fc35
>>
>>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, George Lowry
>>
>>
>wrote:
>
>
>>>James,
>>>
>>>A couple of thoughts: The best way to fill the batteries is to
>>>
>>>
>use an
>
>
>>>automatic fill device such as came standard on our Alpine Apex.
>>>
>>>
>All you
>
>
>>>have to do is flip a switch until the float indicators tell you
>>>
>>>
>all
>
>
>>>cells are full. You can't overfill. System holds around a gallon
>>>
>>>
>of
>
>
>>>distilled water. Before we got this, we used a douche/enema
>>>
>>>
>bag. holds
>
>
>>>a quart of water and is easy to control.
>>>
>>>If you want to add to usable capacity, if you have not already
>>>
>>>
>added a
>
>
>>>three stage charging system, do that. A standard single stage
>>>
>>>
>charger
>
>
>>>will only fill the battery to approximately 85% of its AH
>>>
>>>
>capacity.
>
>
>>>Since you should not discharge to less that 50% of capacity, you
>>>
>>>
>have
>
>
>>>lost 30% of usable right off the top. The three stage charger
>>>
>>>
>will
>
>
>>>charge to 100% of capacity gaining you that 30% in usable
>>>
>>>
>capacity.
>
>
>>>Not only do you get more usable battery capacity but the
>>>
>>>
>batteries will
>
>
>>>last longer also.
>>>
>>>George Lowry
>>>'06 Alpine Apex - Former owner '95 WBDA 4203
>>>Spearfish, SD enjoying the warmth in Palm Springs.
>>>
>>>orbitalsolutions wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hello, Fred. According to the Trojan Web Site the dimentions
>>>>
>>>>
>are
>
>
>>>>identical for the T-105 and the T-125. The T-145 is apx. 7/8
>>>>
>>>>
>of an
>
>
>>>>inch taller with the same footprint.
>>>>
>>>>I do not know what a Blue Point filler is. Sounds interesting
>>>>though. I fill my batteries with a baster and an eye droper.
>>>>
>>>>
>I get
>
>
>>>>the job done eventually, with minimum spilliage and believe I
>>>>
>>>>
>can do
>
>
>>>>the same with the taller T-145's in my '78 FC.
>>>>
>>>>I still have not priced the T-145's, but they are a nice jump
>>>>
>>>>
>in
>
>
>>>>AH's, at 12VDC you can add a useable 70 AH's !!
>>>>
>>>>-James
>>>>78FC33SB
>>>>LasVegas NV
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "fred89sp"
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I have T 125s (taller than the T 105s) in my 89SP and my Blue
>>>>>
>>>>>
>Point
>
>
>>>>>battery filler just fits.
>>>>>
>>>>>How do you top off your batteries with the added height of the
>>>>>
>>>>>
>T
>
>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>145s,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>have you found a lower profile battery filler?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, dspithaler@ wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Hi James I have four T-145's in my house compartment up
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>front
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>&
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>they work good for me. I have had them in for two years. Just
>>>>>
>>>>>
>make
>
>
>>>>>sure you have the room for the higher batteries in the
>>>>>
>>>>>
>compartment.
>
>
>>>>>They are in a 89 SP 36'. I had T-105's in my 79 FC that worked
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>good also.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>Don 89 SP 36'
>>>>>>Butler, PA in Zephyrhills FL right now
>>>>>>
>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>From: orbitalsolutions
>>>>>>To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
>>>>>>Sent: Wed, 01 Feb 2006 01:44:43 -0000
>>>>>>Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Trojan Batteries And Chargers
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I just finished looking at the Trojan Web Site. There are
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>three
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>models
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>that I want to talk about -- T-105, T-125, T-145.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>These are all identical in dimensions with the only exception
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>being that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>the T-145 is slightly less than an inch taller.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Here are the 20hr rates -- T-105 = 225AH, T-125 = 240AH, T-
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>145 =
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>260AH.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>The only other difference is their weight -- T-105 = 60lbs, T-
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>125 =
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>66lbs, T-145 = 72lbs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Seems like the heavier models have larger plates and should
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>have
>
>
>>>>>>greater durability, I suppose, more Amp Hours for sure. So I
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>am
>
>
>>>>>>wondering why everyone uses the T-105's? Is there a problem
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>with
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>using
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>the higher reated models?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>If any one has any input on a new charge/converter to replace
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>the
>
>
>>>>>>original I would appreciate it. the original
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>charger/converter
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>works
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>fine but I have been told that it will boil the batteries. In
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>fact, the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>previous owner of my bus has a timer in line with the charger
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>to
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>prevent
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>it from running full time when the bus is "pluged in." This
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>actually
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>works fine but I'm assuming that it is a one stage charger
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>and
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>was
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>wondering if it would make sense to replace it with a modern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>3
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>stage
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>job.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
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