Inverter Wiring

[Pete Masterson]

I can't say how earlier 'bird inverters are set up... On my coach the
transfer switch appears to be integrated with the inverter. The
transfer switch selects the inverter if not other 120 VAC is
available (from shore power or generator). The inverter 120 VAC
output passes through (in my case, with dual inverters) 4 circuit
breakers that "protect" the inverter 120 VAC circuits.

These CBs are located in a separate spot a short way from the main
120 VAC power distribution panel (in my case, behind a door on the
engine bulkhead in the bedroom).

It is my understanding that earlier year coaches may have had
separate inverters, transfer switches, and chargers -- and many of
the earlier inverters had a circuit breaker on the inverter that
protected it from overload.

Later "inverters" have combined the transfer switch, inverter, and
charger in a single unit -- some with on-unit circuit breakers, some
that (should) use external circuit breakers, and some with both.

However, no matter how your coach is physically wired up, if you plan
to add a significant new load (such as a basement freezer that might
draw as much as 8 or 10 amps), then it seems like a wise precaution
to add a secondary inverter just for that device or upgrade the
primary inverter to handle the additional load. Since a freezer has
an electric motor, it's probably wise to ensure that you have full
sine wave current from the inverter to avoid the potential for motor
overheating and less efficient operation (that will eat amp-hours
from the batteries). Of course, a dedicated circuit from the inverter
to the freezer is wise.

I realize that this doesn't actually answer how the transfer between
the inverter power and shore power are accomplished. I can only guess
that the inverter output is passed to the appropriate circuits
following the main 120 VAC distribution panel, leaving it to the
transfer switch to keep inverter/shore/generator power separated.
Perhaps someone else can explain how BB set up that part of the
wiring...

Pete Masterson
'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
aeonix1@...
On the road at Edinburg, VA



On Oct 21, 2008, at 12:53 PM, Gregory OConnor wrote:

> Pete, there is a group of switches that stand between the 120V
> electric panel and the receptical/appliance. when you power on the
> inverter I believe the inverter sends 12volts to the On On switch
> and removes shore/gen 120v (what ever the transfer switch is sending)
> and paths the power from the inverter.ON1= shore/gen ON2=inverter.
> If the switch fails one of the inverterpowered paths wont switch
> between the two choices
>
> Wierd thing is I cant seem to understand how the
> receptical/appliance is then protected. The power no longer rus thru
> the houshhold style pandnel breaker box but goes directly from the
> inverter total output source. I guess any leg once powered by
> inverter then has the ability to draw 12.5 amps (or 30 amps if the
> individual inverter is a 3600watt). would be good to understand the
> protection of circuit wires when you add a larger inverter and more
> demand.
> Greg94ptCa
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
> wrote:
>>
>> The inverters in a BB are set up with their own distribution
> wiring
>> (separate from the main 120 vac panel). So, follow the output
> wires
>> from the inverter and you should find a distribution system
> (possibly
>> with circuit breakers) somewhere nearby. You can 'join' a new
> wire
>> there (or set up an additional circuit breaker) to run to the
>> location of the freezer.
>>
>> Load: you first need to determine what the general load on the
>> inverter is at present. What devices are attached and how many
> are
>> used at the same time? It may be that all the available load is
>> (potentially) used up by the existing appliances.
>>
>> Appliances almost always have watt or amp ratings on them (usually
> on
>> a tag by the manufacturer's name on the back). To ease
> calculations,
>> convert all ratings to either watts or amps. (Amps x volts (120)
> =
>> watts or Watts divided by volts (120) = amps) So, a 1500 watt
>> inverter can handle about 12.5 amps in total. You should leave a
>> couple hundred watts (2 amps or so) "free" to allow for
> calculation
>> errors and electrical efficiency. Motors (which don't "like"
> certain
>> types of inverters) prefer "true sine wave" power -- something an
>> older inverter may not provide. Motors (the freezer compressor)
> also
>> draw as much at 50 more power at start up than their rating, so
>> allowance must be made for that, as well.
>>
>> In all probability, the inverter on your coach is already wired up
> to
>> use most of its maximum rated power for the appliances already
>> attached. I expect, depending on the size of the freezer, that
> you
>> will find that it draws anywhere from 6 to 8 amps up to around 10
>> amps. (Remember to add for the brief overload for motor start up.)
>>
>> So, the solution(s) are (1) upgrade the existing inverter from a
> 1500
>> watt unit to a 2500 watt, true sine wave unit or (2) add a second
>> inverter of about 1000-1500 watts (depending on the size of your
>> freezer) to handle only the freezer circuit.
>>
>> Keep in mind that the additional 'juice' required for the
> inverter
>> will come at the expense of the batteries. If you only use the
>> freezer/inverter while on the road, the engine alternator should
> be
>> replenishing the house batteries to offset the load, but while
>> parked, the house batteries will need to provide the inverter
> power,
>> and I know from personal experience (I have a home-style 22 cu ft
>> side-by-side refrigerator-freezer) that refrigeration can draw
> down
>> batteries rather quickly. You may need to consider adding
> additional
>> house batteries (or otherwise increasing the available amp-hours)
> to
>> compensate for the additional demand.
>>
>> Pete Masterson
>> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
>> aeonix1@...
>> On the road at Edinburg, VA
>>
>>
>>
>> On Oct 20, 2008, at 8:42 PM, Don Spithaler wrote:
>>
>>> Guys---I want to set a small freezer in one my outside bays.
> There is
>>> a plug there but how do I wire it to run off the inverter while
> going
>>> down the road? How would I know if it will run off a 1500 W
> inverter?
>>> Thanks
>>> Don Spithaler
>>> 89 SP 36'
>>> Butler, PA
>>>
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[joepat50]

On my '87 PT the inverter has its own 15a breaker.
The output of the inverter goes to a relay in the kitchen area (mine
was under the sink) that BB calls the 'ice maker relay', but is really
the transfer relay. That relay's coil is hooked to either the genny
or shore power through the power selector switch.
When the relay is not energized the circuts hooked to it are fed from
the inverter, when shore or genny power is avaiable the relay picks up
and those circuts are fed from that source.

HTH, Joe






--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson

wrote:
>
> I can't say how earlier 'bird inverters are set up... On my coach the
> transfer switch appears to be integrated with the inverter. The
> transfer switch selects the inverter if not other 120 VAC is
> available (from shore power or generator). The inverter 120 VAC
> output passes through (in my case, with dual inverters) 4 circuit
> breakers that "protect" the inverter 120 VAC circuits.
>
> These CBs are located in a separate spot a short way from the main
> 120 VAC power distribution panel (in my case, behind a door on the
> engine bulkhead in the bedroom).
>
> It is my understanding that earlier year coaches may have had
> separate inverters, transfer switches, and chargers -- and many of
> the earlier inverters had a circuit breaker on the inverter that
> protected it from overload.
>
> Later "inverters" have combined the transfer switch, inverter, and
> charger in a single unit -- some with on-unit circuit breakers, some
> that (should) use external circuit breakers, and some with both.
>
> However, no matter how your coach is physically wired up, if you plan
> to add a significant new load (such as a basement freezer that might
> draw as much as 8 or 10 amps), then it seems like a wise precaution
> to add a secondary inverter just for that device or upgrade the
> primary inverter to handle the additional load. Since a freezer has
> an electric motor, it's probably wise to ensure that you have full
> sine wave current from the inverter to avoid the potential for motor
> overheating and less efficient operation (that will eat amp-hours
> from the batteries). Of course, a dedicated circuit from the inverter
> to the freezer is wise.
>
> I realize that this doesn't actually answer how the transfer between
> the inverter power and shore power are accomplished. I can only guess
> that the inverter output is passed to the appropriate circuits
> following the main 120 VAC distribution panel, leaving it to the
> transfer switch to keep inverter/shore/generator power separated.
> Perhaps someone else can explain how BB set up that part of the
> wiring...
>
> Pete Masterson
> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
> aeonix1@...
> On the road at Edinburg, VA
>
>
>
> On Oct 21, 2008, at 12:53 PM, Gregory OConnor wrote:
>
> > Pete, there is a group of switches that stand between the 120V
> > electric panel and the receptical/appliance. when you power on the
> > inverter I believe the inverter sends 12volts to the On On switch
> > and removes shore/gen 120v (what ever the transfer switch is sending)
> > and paths the power from the inverter.ON1= shore/gen ON2=inverter.
> > If the switch fails one of the inverterpowered paths wont switch
> > between the two choices
> >
> > Wierd thing is I cant seem to understand how the
> > receptical/appliance is then protected. The power no longer rus thru
> > the houshhold style pandnel breaker box but goes directly from the
> > inverter total output source. I guess any leg once powered by
> > inverter then has the ability to draw 12.5 amps (or 30 amps if the
> > individual inverter is a 3600watt). would be good to understand the
> > protection of circuit wires when you add a larger inverter and more
> > demand.
> > Greg94ptCa
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> The inverters in a BB are set up with their own distribution
> > wiring
> >> (separate from the main 120 vac panel). So, follow the output
> > wires
> >> from the inverter and you should find a distribution system
> > (possibly
> >> with circuit breakers) somewhere nearby. You can 'join' a new
> > wire
> >> there (or set up an additional circuit breaker) to run to the
> >> location of the freezer.
> >>
> >> Load: you first need to determine what the general load on the
> >> inverter is at present. What devices are attached and how many
> > are
> >> used at the same time? It may be that all the available load is
> >> (potentially) used up by the existing appliances.
> >>
> >> Appliances almost always have watt or amp ratings on them (usually
> > on
> >> a tag by the manufacturer's name on the back). To ease
> > calculations,
> >> convert all ratings to either watts or amps. (Amps x volts (120)
> > =
> >> watts or Watts divided by volts (120) = amps) So, a 1500 watt
> >> inverter can handle about 12.5 amps in total. You should leave a
> >> couple hundred watts (2 amps or so) "free" to allow for
> > calculation
> >> errors and electrical efficiency. Motors (which don't "like"
> > certain
> >> types of inverters) prefer "true sine wave" power -- something an
> >> older inverter may not provide. Motors (the freezer compressor)
> > also
> >> draw as much at 50 more power at start up than their rating, so
> >> allowance must be made for that, as well.
> >>
> >> In all probability, the inverter on your coach is already wired up
> > to
> >> use most of its maximum rated power for the appliances already
> >> attached. I expect, depending on the size of the freezer, that
> > you
> >> will find that it draws anywhere from 6 to 8 amps up to around 10
> >> amps. (Remember to add for the brief overload for motor start up.)
> >>
> >> So, the solution(s) are (1) upgrade the existing inverter from a
> > 1500
> >> watt unit to a 2500 watt, true sine wave unit or (2) add a second
> >> inverter of about 1000-1500 watts (depending on the size of your
> >> freezer) to handle only the freezer circuit.
> >>
> >> Keep in mind that the additional 'juice' required for the
> > inverter
> >> will come at the expense of the batteries. If you only use the
> >> freezer/inverter while on the road, the engine alternator should
> > be
> >> replenishing the house batteries to offset the load, but while
> >> parked, the house batteries will need to provide the inverter
> > power,
> >> and I know from personal experience (I have a home-style 22 cu ft
> >> side-by-side refrigerator-freezer) that refrigeration can draw
> > down
> >> batteries rather quickly. You may need to consider adding
> > additional
> >> house batteries (or otherwise increasing the available amp-hours)
> > to
> >> compensate for the additional demand.
> >>
> >> Pete Masterson
> >> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
> >> aeonix1@
> >> On the road at Edinburg, VA
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Oct 20, 2008, at 8:42 PM, Don Spithaler wrote:
> >>
> >>> Guys---I want to set a small freezer in one my outside bays.
> > There is
> >>> a plug there but how do I wire it to run off the inverter while
> > going
> >>> down the road? How would I know if it will run off a 1500 W
> > inverter?
> >>> Thanks
> >>> Don Spithaler
> >>> 89 SP 36'
> >>> Butler, PA
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

[Pete Masterson]

If the freezer is that small, then you shouldn't need to upgrade
anything. Just find a 120 vac outlet (socket) that's already on the
inverter (in your basement) and relocate or extend it to reach the
spot where your freezer will be placed. 95/120 is > 1 amp so it's not
a significant load. However, the concern over sine wave vs. modified
sine wave vs. square wave output from the inverter is an issue. If
the freezer has a compressor motor, it will run best on true sine
wave current. It will (likely) run, but less efficiently, on modified
sine wave (the motor will run hotter and draw more current, perhaps
1.5 amps) -- this will cause it to eventually fail sooner than it
would if run on true sine wave current. It probably won't run on
square wave inverted power. I assume you have a microwave (that works
on inverter power) so, you most probably have modified sine wave.
You're not at a great risk of overwhelming your inverter with this
additional load.

BTW, check to see if the freezer actually has a compressor -- there
are some small refrigeration devices that use a solid-state device
for cooling. They're usually pretty small (and don't draw much
power), however they're also much less demanding about the type of
wave received on the AC power. (They typically have an internal power
supply that turns the electricity back into DC for the solid state
device.)

Pete Masterson
'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
aeonix1@...
On the road at Edinburg, VA



On Oct 21, 2008, at 7:02 PM, Donald Spithaler wrote:

> Pete
> The freezer that I'm looking at is small. It is 115V / 95W so it
> would be drawing under 1 amp. Is that right? I would be only using
> the inverter while going down the road. We don't dry camp any. On
> the road the only thing on the inverter would be the TV & my
> laptop. I'm not ready to upgrade the inverter at this time & I
> don't want to get into that unless I have to.
> Don Spithaler
> 89 SP 36'
> Butler, PA
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:52 AM, Pete Masterson
> wrote
> The inverters in a BB are set up with their own distribution wiring
> (separate from the main 120 vac panel). So, follow the output wires
> from the inverter and you should find a distribution system (possibly
> with circuit breakers) somewhere nearby. You can 'join' a new wire
> there (or set up an additional circuit breaker) to run to the
> location of the freezer.
>
> Load: you first need to determine what the general load on the
> inverter is at present. What devices are attached and how many are
> used at the same time? It may be that all the available load is
> (potentially) used up by the existing appliances.
>
> Appliances almost always have watt or amp ratings on them (usually on
> a tag by the manufacturer's name on the back). To ease calculations,
> convert all ratings to either watts or amps. (Amps x volts (120) =
> watts or Watts divided by volts (120) = amps) So, a 1500 watt
> inverter can handle about 12.5 amps in total. You should leave a
> couple hundred watts (2 amps or so) "free" to allow for calculation
> errors and electrical efficiency. Motors (which don't "like" certain
> types of inverters) prefer "true sine wave" power -- something an
> older inverter may not provide. Motors (the freezer compressor) also
> draw as much at 50 more power at start up than their rating, so
> allowance must be made for that, as well.
>
> In all probability, the inverter on your coach is already wired up to
> use most of its maximum rated power for the appliances already
> attached. I expect, depending on the size of the freezer, that you
> will find that it draws anywhere from 6 to 8 amps up to around 10
> amps. (Remember to add for the brief overload for motor start up.)
>
> So, the solution(s) are (1) upgrade the existing inverter from a 1500
> watt unit to a 2500 watt, true sine wave unit or (2) add a second
> inverter of about 1000-1500 watts (depending on the size of your
> freezer) to handle only the freezer circuit.
>
> Keep in mind that the additional 'juice' required for the inverter
> will come at the expense of the batteries. If you only use the
> freezer/inverter while on the road, the engine alternator should be
> replenishing the house batteries to offset the load, but while
> parked, the house batteries will need to provide the inverter power,
> and I know from personal experience (I have a home-style 22 cu ft
> side-by-side refrigerator-freezer) that refrigeration can draw down
> batteries rather quickly. You may need to consider adding additional
> house batteries (or otherwise increasing the available amp-hours) to
> compensate for the additional demand.
>
> Pete Masterson
> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
> aeonix1@...
> On the road at Edinburg, VA
>
>
>
> On Oct 20, 2008, at 8:42 PM, Don Spithaler wrote:
>
> > Guys---I want to set a small freezer in one my outside bays.
> There is
> > a plug there but how do I wire it to run off the inverter while
> going
> > down the road? How would I know if it will run off a 1500 W
> inverter?
> > Thanks
> > Don Spithaler
> > 89 SP 36'
> > Butler, PA
> >
>
>

[Gregory OConnor]

Pete on the old campers like yours and mine the inverters are not as
intuitive as the solid state thing a ma gigs of todays rv's.
Wanderlodge put in a bank of switches outside of the inverter to
prove cutting edge. If you look at the KurtFiles CD scan 511pdf you
will find a bluprint of how the '95 switches between inverter and
shore power. there are a row of switches labeled "circuit 14", 24,
13,28, and 7. I would guess the switches are 12volt tripped by a
signal from or lack of signal from the inverter. but carry 120volt
to pass.

If you have issue with one of the labeled items like the refer not
powering up on one of the AltCurrent choices, it could be the
switch not making the change over.
It appears as if the inverter is powered to items like the refer
after the large house style altcurrent circuit breaker panel. to
test you could run an item on shorepower and prove that tripping the
circuitB would shut it down then remove shore power and run the item
on inverter only and trip it at the panel. I think it will stay
powered

Greg94ptCa

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
wrote:
>
> I can't say how earlier 'bird inverters are set up... On my coach
the
> transfer switch appears to be integrated with the inverter. The
> transfer switch selects the inverter if not other 120 VAC is
> available (from shore power or generator). The inverter 120 VAC
> output passes through (in my case, with dual inverters) 4 circuit
> breakers that "protect" the inverter 120 VAC circuits.

[Pete Masterson]

Greg,

I already discovered that the shore/generator power distribution box
doesn't affect the inverters. When my coach is stored, I turn off my
(home style) refrigerator _and_ pull the breaker (to turn off the
light). I normally have shore power available to keep the batteries
charged. I was surprised to notice, after unplugging the shore power,
that the light in the refrigerator was on (the inverters kicked in
automatically). Fortunately, I'd turned off the refrigerator, so only
the light came on. (I keep the door propped open a couple of inches
to let the inside fully air out so mildew won't grow in my normally
dry climate.) That's how I figured that the inverter power is tied
into the circuits it serves downstream from the main distribution panel.

I'll have to look at the KurtFiles CD -- I just got my copy a couple
of days ago, forwarded to me by my house-sitter -- but working time
on my coach is limited while we're on the road. I'm not sure I've run
across the switches (circuit 14, 24, etc.) you mention -- but I'm
going exploring in the inverter box in the next hour or so....

Pete Masterson
'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
aeonix1@...
On the road at Edinburg, VA



On Oct 22, 2008, at 11:45 AM, Gregory OConnor wrote:

> Pete on the old campers like yours and mine the inverters are not as
> intuitive as the solid state thing a ma gigs of todays rv's.
> Wanderlodge put in a bank of switches outside of the inverter to
> prove cutting edge. If you look at the KurtFiles CD scan 511pdf you
> will find a bluprint of how the '95 switches between inverter and
> shore power. there are a row of switches labeled "circuit 14", 24,
> 13,28, and 7. I would guess the switches are 12volt tripped by a
> signal from or lack of signal from the inverter. but carry 120volt
> to pass.
>
> If you have issue with one of the labeled items like the refer not
> powering up on one of the AltCurrent choices, it could be the
> switch not making the change over.
> It appears as if the inverter is powered to items like the refer
> after the large house style altcurrent circuit breaker panel. to
> test you could run an item on shorepower and prove that tripping the
> circuitB would shut it down then remove shore power and run the item
> on inverter only and trip it at the panel. I think it will stay
> powered
>
> Greg94ptCa
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
> wrote:
>>
>> I can't say how earlier 'bird inverters are set up... On my coach
> the
>> transfer switch appears to be integrated with the inverter. The
>> transfer switch selects the inverter if not other 120 VAC is
>> available (from shore power or generator). The inverter 120 VAC
>> output passes through (in my case, with dual inverters) 4 circuit
>> breakers that "protect" the inverter 120 VAC circuits.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[Gregory OConnor]

Hence every thing running on inverter is only protected from
over/amp by the minimal size breaker on the output side of the
inverter. without reguard to the capacity of that circuit protected
on shore/gen by the homestyle circuit breaker. Its a good point to
keep inmind when upgrading to a larger inverter. I kinda think the
inverter output side breaker is there to protect amp draw from
damaging the inverter and not the circuit????

A two amp draw on a fridge proves that new technology with fridges,
ac units and other appliances is the way to increase capacity of
inverter dry camping over a new larger inverter. I still havent
installed a new inverter charger. I want to learn what all the shunt
and other confusing crap serves so I can bring the cahrging and
using of batteries up to the current times. I also need to find out
if the switch in the shorecord bay (charge rate) causes a charging
problem with a P/O (previous owner) charger upgrade???????

Greg94ptCa
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
wrote:
>
> Greg,
>
> I already discovered that the shore/generator power distribution
box
> doesn't affect the inverters. When my coach is stored, I turn off
my
> (home style) refrigerator _and_ pull the breaker (to turn off the
> light). I normally have shore power available to keep the
batteries
> charged. I was surprised to notice, after unplugging the shore
power,
> that the light in the refrigerator was on (the inverters kicked
in
> automatically). Fortunately, I'd turned off the refrigerator, so
only
> the light came on. (I keep the door propped open a couple of
inches
> to let the inside fully air out so mildew won't grow in my
normally
> dry climate.) That's how I figured that the inverter power is
tied
> into the circuits it serves downstream from the main distribution
panel.
>
> I'll have to look at the KurtFiles CD -- I just got my copy a
couple
> of days ago, forwarded to me by my house-sitter -- but working
time
> on my coach is limited while we're on the road. I'm not sure I've
run
> across the switches (circuit 14, 24, etc.) you mention -- but I'm
> going exploring in the inverter box in the next hour or so....
>
> Pete Masterson
> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
> aeonix1@...
> On the road at Edinburg, VA
>
>
>
> On Oct 22, 2008, at 11:45 AM, Gregory OConnor wrote:
>
> > Pete on the old campers like yours and mine the inverters are
not as
> > intuitive as the solid state thing a ma gigs of todays rv's.
> > Wanderlodge put in a bank of switches outside of the inverter to
> > prove cutting edge. If you look at the KurtFiles CD scan 511pdf
you
> > will find a bluprint of how the '95 switches between inverter and
> > shore power. there are a row of switches labeled "circuit 14",
24,
> > 13,28, and 7. I would guess the switches are 12volt tripped by a
> > signal from or lack of signal from the inverter. but carry
120volt
> > to pass.
> >
> > If you have issue with one of the labeled items like the refer
not
> > powering up on one of the AltCurrent choices, it could be the
> > switch not making the change over.
> > It appears as if the inverter is powered to items like the refer
> > after the large house style altcurrent circuit breaker panel. to
> > test you could run an item on shorepower and prove that tripping
the
> > circuitB would shut it down then remove shore power and run the
item
> > on inverter only and trip it at the panel. I think it will stay
> > powered
> >
> > Greg94ptCa
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> I can't say how earlier 'bird inverters are set up... On my
coach
> > the
> >> transfer switch appears to be integrated with the inverter. The
> >> transfer switch selects the inverter if not other 120 VAC is
> >> available (from shore power or generator). The inverter 120 VAC
> >> output passes through (in my case, with dual inverters) 4
circuit
> >> breakers that "protect" the inverter 120 VAC circuits.
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

[Donald Spithaler]

Thanks Greg, Pete & all you guys for the input on the inverter. I'll see if I can get a wire to the bay to run the freezer.
Don Spithaler
89 SP 36'
Butler, PA

On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 3:01 PM, Gregory OConnor <"Gregoryoc@aol.com"> wrote:

Hence every thing running on inverter is only protected from

over/amp by the minimal size breaker on the output side of the

inverter. without reguard to the capacity of that circuit protected

on shore/gen by the homestyle circuit breaker. Its a good point to

keep inmind when upgrading to a larger inverter. I kinda think the

inverter output side breaker is there to protect amp draw from

damaging the inverter and not the circuit????



A two amp draw on a fridge proves that new technology with fridges,

ac units and other appliances is the way to increase capacity of

inverter dry camping over a new larger inverter. I still havent

installed a new inverter charger. I want to learn what all the shunt

and other confusing crap serves so I can bring the cahrging and

using of batteries up to the current times. I also need to find out

if the switch in the shorecord bay (charge rate) causes a charging

problem with a P/O (previous owner) charger upgrade???????

Greg94ptCa

--- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", Pete Masterson

wrote:

>

> Greg,

>

> I already discovered that the shore/generator power distribution

box

> doesn't affect the inverters. When my coach is stored, I turn off

my

> (home style) refrigerator _and_ pull the breaker (to turn off the

> light). I normally have shore power available to keep the

batteries

> charged. I was surprised to notice, after unplugging the shore

power,

> that the light in the refrigerator was on (the inverters kicked

in

> automatically). Fortunately, I'd turned off the refrigerator, so

only

> the light came on. (I keep the door propped open a couple of

inches

> to let the inside fully air out so mildew won't grow in my

normally

> dry climate.) That's how I figured that the inverter power is

tied

> into the circuits it serves downstream from the main distribution

panel.

>

> I'll have to look at the KurtFiles CD -- I just got my copy a

couple

> of days ago, forwarded to me by my house-sitter -- but working

time

> on my coach is limited while we're on the road. I'm not sure I've

run

> across the switches (circuit 14, 24, etc.) you mention -- but I'm

> going exploring in the inverter box in the next hour or so....

>

> Pete Masterson

> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

> aeonix1@...

> On the road at Edinburg, VA

>

>

>

> On Oct 22, 2008, at 11:45 AM, Gregory OConnor wrote:

>

> > Pete on the old campers like yours and mine the inverters are

not as

> > intuitive as the solid state thing a ma gigs of todays rv's.

> > Wanderlodge put in a bank of switches outside of the inverter to

> > prove cutting edge. If you look at the KurtFiles CD scan 511pdf

you

> > will find a bluprint of how the '95 switches between inverter and

> > shore power. there are a row of switches labeled "circuit 14",

24,

> > 13,28, and 7. I would guess the switches are 12volt tripped by a

> > signal from or lack of signal from the inverter. but carry

120volt

> > to pass.

> >

> > If you have issue with one of the labeled items like the refer

not

> > powering up on one of the AltCurrent choices, it could be the

> > switch not making the change over.

> > It appears as if the inverter is powered to items like the refer

> > after the large house style altcurrent circuit breaker panel. to

> > test you could run an item on shorepower and prove that tripping

the

> > circuitB would shut it down then remove shore power and run the

item

> > on inverter only and trip it at the panel. I think it will stay

> > powered

> >

> > Greg94ptCa

> >

> > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", Pete Masterson

> > wrote:

> >>

> >> I can't say how earlier 'bird inverters are set up... On my

coach

> > the

> >> transfer switch appears to be integrated with the inverter. The

> >> transfer switch selects the inverter if not other 120 VAC is

> >> available (from shore power or generator). The inverter 120 VAC

> >> output passes through (in my case, with dual inverters) 4

circuit

> >> breakers that "protect" the inverter 120 VAC circuits.

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> > Yahoo! Groups Links

> >

> >

> >

>