generator weirdness
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12-23-2006, 03:04
Post: #11
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generator weirdness
Our generator battery did the same thing, when the voltage got to low
the fuel selonoid closed and it would shut down. I now put a 10 amp battery charger in the tray when we get somewhere and it keeps itself charged when it runs, have had no problems since I started doing this. I know its not the right way and it adds another thing to do when you get somewhere but it works. Mr. Miller had a fix for this but I could not figure it out myself, a Kohler generator shop in Green Bay told me this was the way they would do it. Someday I would like to get it working the right way though. Michelle and Jeff August 1980FC35RB Plymouth Wi. Merry Christmas Everyone! --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg" > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge his > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can put an > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator will run > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone have > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-83PT40 in > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there > |
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12-23-2006, 04:50
Post: #12
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generator weirdness
On our 88 FC , the Onan has an alternator, it charges the battery
when the Onan is running. This is easy to check with a volt meter. The generator battery is also charged by shore power or the 3208 alternator. The diode that Ralph mentions is located behind the entry steps( on our 88 FC), It is a hefty fat diode , I would guess at about 80 amps. There is also an automotive type fuse link, next to these parts is the Aux Battery solenoid to tie all batteries together for weak battery starting. All located center coach behind the step near the leveler reservoir tank and motor. There is also a relay in the left side front load center, that is energized with 12 volts to latch these charging circuit together, when on shore power or 3208 alternator charging, This circuit is also fused with a glass automotive fuse. So check this circuit. This could be a trouble area. It is a good idea to check the age and load test all batteries before replacing. Bill 88 FC Michigan/Florida --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider" > > I don't have a charging print for a PT off hand, so this is from memory. > > Unlike the '84/'85FC's which have a 160 amp battery isolator, the PT > usually had a large diode rectifier located in the gen set battery circuit. > The diode allowed voltage to pass from the alt or charger but not back, > ergo isolated. The out put side of the gen set battery follows the usual 2 > solenoid pattern for the battery tie switch. Two of the solenoids are under > the entry door step and the third is usually found in the gen set > compartment on the curb side wall, near the breaker box for the gen set. > Also in the '84, there was not an alt. installed on the Perkins for > charging. The second solenoid in the gen set compartment was not installed > on all PT's it is also an isolation circuit. > > So, going from the above, here is a list of "might be's" > 1. The Diode is bad, not allowing the gen set battery to charge. (usually > located under the drivers side front behind the bumper area) > 2. The charger side of the inverter is not hooked up to the gen set battery > to charge when the gen set is running > 3. The tie solenoid contacts are welded together. > 4. Or as Jay mentioned, there is a high resistance short in the cable some > where. > > There are a couple of other things I have seen happen but they are rare so > won't go there right now. > > Would help to have a PT schematic of an '84 or '85 PT to trace out. > > Ralph > > > At 11:45 PM 12/22/2006 +0000, you wrote: > >dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge his > >generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can put an > >aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator will run > >from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone have > >ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-83PT40 in > >Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there > > > > > |
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12-23-2006, 05:31
Post: #13
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generator weirdness
I would replace the battery too. or just un ground it and jump in a
pepboys jump pack to keep the fuel open and pumped. If it is a diode, what caused it to fail? Low amp starts on a diesel started always cost me a rebuild. GregoryO'Connor 94ptRomolandCa--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Wilhelmus Schreurs > > Jay: > I have to agree with you except for the "replace battery with good one". Since he puts the aux charger on and it works ok, then in theory it should work with the inverter/charger as well. > When you put the charger on, do you clip the positive and negative directly to the battery, if that is the case, how about the "GROUND" again. To complete the answer, we need some more info as Jay has requested. > > Bill 84 FC 35 SB "$quanderlodge" > Terrace, B.C. Canada > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Jay Darst > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 5:49:18 PM > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: generator weirdness > > Replace the battery with a known good one. > > Take a volt reading on the gen battery with out anything running. > > Now, with the Inverter in charge mode(either shore power or gen power > connected), check the voltage at the gen battery. If the voltage does > not increase with the inverter/charger on, probably the isolator has > an issue or there is a broken wire from the rear compartment running > up to the gen battery. My brothers FC had a 2ga cable with hole > rubbed in the insulation, about mid coach. Ran from the battery bank > to the stock inverter. Kept depleting his battery bank. > > I removed the factory isolator, someone told me it was a rectified > isolator- don't have a clue what the "rectified" part is. Anyway, the > new isolator is a Sure Power Industries 24023A, 160 amp isolator. > Looses about .2 volts input to output posts. Bought brand new on E- > bay for $90. > > I'm guessing now... > Maybe the fuel solenoid is compromised and requires higher volatge to > remain in the ON position???? > Is the connection to the fuel solenoid not so good? > Where's Ralph? > > Jay Darst > 85PT40 > Springfield, IL > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com, "one_dusty_hoot" > > > > > Ernie, sound to me like the aux charger is keeping > > the fuel pump going,no fuel will kill it. Check the > > genset alternator, source of battery problem too. > > bob janes, greenville, sc > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com, "Ernest Ekberg" > > > > > > > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge > his > > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can > put > > an > > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator > will > > run > > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone > have > > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie- 83PT40 > in > > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > |
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12-23-2006, 09:11
Post: #14
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generator weirdness
For those that are interested in attending a rally here in NY in the
spring troubleshooting of the charging system may be of interest to you as well as how to check isolators, how they are constructed etc. tom warner vernon center,ny 1985 PT 40 --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Jay Darst" wrote: > > Replace the battery with a known good one. > > Take a volt reading on the gen battery with out anything running. > > Now, with the Inverter in charge mode(either shore power or gen power > connected), check the voltage at the gen battery. If the voltage does > not increase with the inverter/charger on, probably the isolator has > an issue or there is a broken wire from the rear compartment running > up to the gen battery. My brothers FC had a 2ga cable with hole > rubbed in the insulation, about mid coach. Ran from the battery bank > to the stock inverter. Kept depleting his battery bank. > > I removed the factory isolator, someone told me it was a rectified > isolator- don't have a clue what the "rectified" part is. Anyway, the > new isolator is a Sure Power Industries 24023A, 160 amp isolator. > Looses about .2 volts input to output posts. Bought brand new on E- > bay for $90. > > I'm guessing now... > Maybe the fuel solenoid is compromised and requires higher volatge to > remain in the ON position???? > Is the connection to the fuel solenoid not so good? > Where's Ralph? > > Jay Darst > 85PT40 > Springfield, IL > > > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "one_dusty_hoot" > > > > > Ernie, sound to me like the aux charger is keeping > > the fuel pump going,no fuel will kill it. Check the > > genset alternator, source of battery problem too. > > bob janes, greenville, sc > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg" > > > > > > > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge > his > > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can > put > > an > > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator > will > > run > > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone > have > > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie- 83PT40 > in > > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there > > > > > > |
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12-23-2006, 16:27
Post: #15
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generator weirdness
Greetings:
This is similar to a fault I experienced with my '85 PT40. My fix required first replacing the solenoid under the entry step, then the second solenoid mounted in the rear under the battery charger compartment, and finally the 30 Amp circuit breaker mounted near the rear solenoid. The forward solenoid was apparently constantly drawing current, as it was warm to the touch. I replaced it and the rear one as a preventative measure. ($20 each from O'Reilly's.) I think the main problem was the failed circuit breaker, which was open. The diode, if good, should show a voltage drop of around 0.7 volts in the conducting direction. Common failure mode is shorting to ground. Ralph performed the main troubleshooting that helped me resolve this problem. BTW, I think the root cause of the failure was boiling the gen battery dry, leading to excess current in the charging circuit. I have schematics and can provide a copy via email if needed. Otherwise, I'm in the Sanger, TX area for the next week or so. --M.R.Kane '85 PT40 > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg" > > > > > > > > > > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not > charge > > his > > > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can > > put > > > an > > > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator > > will > > > run > > > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. > Anyone > > have > > > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie- > 83PT40 > > in > > > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there > > > > > > > > > > |
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12-23-2006, 16:36
Post: #16
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generator weirdness
Please send me a copy via email. Thank you. One never knows what was the
same, and what was different between 'Bird years. curtsprenger @ adlephia . com remove the spaces. Curt Sprenger 1987 PT38 8V92 "MacAttack Racing" Anaheim Hills, Calif. >I have schematics and can provide a copy via email if needed. >Otherwise, I'm in the Sanger, TX area for the next week or so. > >--M.R.Kane >'85 PT40 > > > > |
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12-27-2006, 02:59
Post: #17
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generator weirdness
Hi Ernie,
My thanks to you and others in the group for possible fixes on the generator problem. I have been gone and did not see the posts until this morning. I took the battery out Friday and left it with Interstate batteries to make sure it was ok. We have some company with us, but hope to do some checking on the Bird today. I expect one of my primary problems will be locating everything (where it is and what it looks like). I will post again when I have worked with it a little. Thanks again so very much. Dave in Tulsa (84 PT 40) --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "mrkane1952" <mrkane@...> wrote: > > Greetings: > > This is similar to a fault I experienced with my '85 PT40. My fix > required first replacing the solenoid under the entry step, then the > second solenoid mounted in the rear under the battery charger > compartment, and finally the 30 Amp circuit breaker mounted near the > rear solenoid. > > The forward solenoid was apparently constantly drawing current, as it > was warm to the touch. I replaced it and the rear one as a > preventative measure. ($20 each from O'Reilly's.) I think the main > problem was the failed circuit breaker, which was open. > > The diode, if good, should show a voltage drop of around 0.7 volts in > the conducting direction. Common failure mode is shorting to ground. > > Ralph performed the main troubleshooting that helped me resolve this > problem. BTW, I think the root cause of the failure was boiling the > gen battery dry, leading to excess current in the charging circuit. > > I have schematics and can provide a copy via email if needed. > Otherwise, I'm in the Sanger, TX area for the next week or so. > > --M.R.Kane > '85 PT40 > > > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not > > charge > > > his > > > > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can > > > put > > > > an > > > > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator > > > will > > > > run > > > > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. > > Anyone > > > have > > > > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie- > > 83PT40 > > > in > > > > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > |
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12-27-2006, 03:25
Post: #18
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generator weirdness
Hi Don, Dave wrote me and said he had his grandkids for Christmas. i suspect
when they go home he will be back at work on his generator. Thanks for your input. Ernie Ekberg 83PT40 Weatherford, tx [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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12-27-2006, 05:12
Post: #19
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generator weirdness
In a message dated 12/27/2006 3:08:15 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
dhardy@... writes: Ralph mentioned I should have a diode behind the bumper on driver's side. Dave- don't feel bad. I wouldn't know a diode from anything else- unless it has a label on it that says "diode" Ernie Ekberg 83PT40 Weatherford, tx --electrically challenged [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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12-27-2006, 08:12
Post: #20
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generator weirdness
Ernie,
On my 1987 the genset charge circuit is is tied in to the two hot terminals on the auxillary battery relay (Genset batter + post, and coach batteries + Post). It is a very simple circuit, a 30 amp circuit breaker in line with a 50 amp diode wired between the previous mentioned hot posts. If the diode burns out or the self reseting fuse fails no charge may reach the battery. My genset has no alternator. The main problem with this set up when working is the 0.6 voltage drop accross the diode; the genset battery never sees a decent charge. On my coach I disconnected the diode/circuit braker and installed a 50 amp battery combiner accross the two hot posts. Now whenever charge voltages are present the combiner combines the two coach battery banks (genset/coach) and the genset battery recieves an excellant charge. This bus has no battery isolator. Regards, Don Duncan 1987 PT40 Beaverton, Oregon --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg" > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge his > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can put an > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator will run > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone have > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-83PT40 in > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there > |
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